clovenhooves The Personal Is Political Institutional Sexism Social Media “I walked past a group of boys so young [...], talking about how their classmates were "bops" and "ran through"”

Social Media “I walked past a group of boys so young [...], talking about how their classmates were "bops" and "ran through"”

Social Media “I walked past a group of boys so young [...], talking about how their classmates were "bops" and "ran through"”

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Apr 20 2025, 6:49 PM
#1
I walked past a group of boys so young their voices haven't broken, talking about how their classmates were "bops" and "ran through"
https://www.reddit.com/r/self/comments/1k3me2k/i_walked_past_a_group_of_boys_so_young_their/

MixAffectionate1798 It feels so hopeless. Gen Z men are already saying things so misogynistic even boomers generally don't agree. And these Gen alpha boys are growing up entirely indoctrinated.

I really fear for the younger girls. I'm only 25 but the uptick in virulent misogyny in the teenagers and young boys is terrifying. Those boys will be men one day. And those girls they're talking about will grow into womanhood amongst a cohort who despises them.
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Apr 20 2025, 6:49 PM #1

I walked past a group of boys so young their voices haven't broken, talking about how their classmates were "bops" and "ran through"
https://www.reddit.com/r/self/comments/1k3me2k/i_walked_past_a_group_of_boys_so_young_their/

MixAffectionate1798 It feels so hopeless. Gen Z men are already saying things so misogynistic even boomers generally don't agree. And these Gen alpha boys are growing up entirely indoctrinated.

I really fear for the younger girls. I'm only 25 but the uptick in virulent misogyny in the teenagers and young boys is terrifying. Those boys will be men one day. And those girls they're talking about will grow into womanhood amongst a cohort who despises them.

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Auroch
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Apr 21 2025, 8:34 AM
#2
Ugh, the comments:

"I'm 41 and you should have heard us in grade school and Junior High. This is nothing new."

"Seriously. Teens have always been dicks lol"

"BREAKING NEWS!! Teenage boys are dipshits!"

Is this supposed to be better? "Don't worry - teen boys have always been misogynistic!" Also, of course the one comment conveniently says "teens," not teen boys. They love to gloss over misogyny into making it a vague statement about how "people" are stupid or "people" are violent.

I don't know what kind of teen these people were, but when I was a teen, I knew plenty of teen girls who were lovely. I really don't believe teenagers are destined to be obnoxious. Yes, they lack life experience, and you should show some understanding for that. But teenagers definitely are capable of following basic moral standards. If teenage boys aren't doing that, then there's a problem.
Edited Apr 21 2025, 8:35 AM by Auroch.
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Auroch
Apr 21 2025, 8:34 AM #2

Ugh, the comments:

"I'm 41 and you should have heard us in grade school and Junior High. This is nothing new."

"Seriously. Teens have always been dicks lol"

"BREAKING NEWS!! Teenage boys are dipshits!"

Is this supposed to be better? "Don't worry - teen boys have always been misogynistic!" Also, of course the one comment conveniently says "teens," not teen boys. They love to gloss over misogyny into making it a vague statement about how "people" are stupid or "people" are violent.

I don't know what kind of teen these people were, but when I was a teen, I knew plenty of teen girls who were lovely. I really don't believe teenagers are destined to be obnoxious. Yes, they lack life experience, and you should show some understanding for that. But teenagers definitely are capable of following basic moral standards. If teenage boys aren't doing that, then there's a problem.

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skunk
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Apr 21 2025, 8:52 AM
#3
(Apr 21 2025, 8:34 AM)Auroch Ugh, the comments:

"I'm 41 and you should have heard us in grade school and Junior High. This is nothing new."

"Seriously. Teens have always been dicks lol"

"BREAKING NEWS!! Teenage boys are dipshits!"

Is this supposed to be better? "Don't worry - teen boys have always been misogynistic!" Also, of course the one comment conveniently says "teens," not teen boys. They love to gloss over misogyny into making it a vague statement about how "people" are stupid or "people" are violent.

I don't know what kind of teen these people were, but when I was a teen, I knew plenty of teen girls who were lovely. I really don't believe teenagers are destined to be obnoxious. Yes, they lack life experience, and you should show some understanding for that. But teenagers definitely are capable of following basic moral standards. If teenage boys aren't doing that, then there's a problem.

Its literally just "boys will be boys" on repeat, forever and always. 

I guess there's no need to try to teach them anything! Not like we ever tried before but why bother now?? They're just going to dehumanize girls and women forever and who gives a shit about them?? Totally normal! No problem here! Such hysteria! 

No issues whatsoever with boys learning the most misogynistic bullshit in their most impressionable years in a world that's literally never treated the other sex as equals...
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skunk
Apr 21 2025, 8:52 AM #3

(Apr 21 2025, 8:34 AM)Auroch Ugh, the comments:

"I'm 41 and you should have heard us in grade school and Junior High. This is nothing new."

"Seriously. Teens have always been dicks lol"

"BREAKING NEWS!! Teenage boys are dipshits!"

Is this supposed to be better? "Don't worry - teen boys have always been misogynistic!" Also, of course the one comment conveniently says "teens," not teen boys. They love to gloss over misogyny into making it a vague statement about how "people" are stupid or "people" are violent.

I don't know what kind of teen these people were, but when I was a teen, I knew plenty of teen girls who were lovely. I really don't believe teenagers are destined to be obnoxious. Yes, they lack life experience, and you should show some understanding for that. But teenagers definitely are capable of following basic moral standards. If teenage boys aren't doing that, then there's a problem.

Its literally just "boys will be boys" on repeat, forever and always. 

I guess there's no need to try to teach them anything! Not like we ever tried before but why bother now?? They're just going to dehumanize girls and women forever and who gives a shit about them?? Totally normal! No problem here! Such hysteria! 

No issues whatsoever with boys learning the most misogynistic bullshit in their most impressionable years in a world that's literally never treated the other sex as equals...

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Irinka8347
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May 9 2025, 11:48 AM
#4
That's why I think people should stop having so many boys lol. Whether one thinks their problems are genetic or environmental, I think this is not a good era to raise a male child (has it ever been? Idk)... But now it's more technologically feasible than ever to skip the genetic roulette. I don't want to rely on people "teaching" their boys; everyone thinks, "Oh, I'm gonna raise my son right", the concept of feminism has been active for a while now... and yet, look where we are.

I'm honestly thinking about just having a daughter myself. The state of the world is too dire for a son. I think men just have too much invested in exploiting women, and women will have to make the next big move themselves.
Edited May 9 2025, 11:50 AM by Irinka8347.
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Irinka8347
May 9 2025, 11:48 AM #4

That's why I think people should stop having so many boys lol. Whether one thinks their problems are genetic or environmental, I think this is not a good era to raise a male child (has it ever been? Idk)... But now it's more technologically feasible than ever to skip the genetic roulette. I don't want to rely on people "teaching" their boys; everyone thinks, "Oh, I'm gonna raise my son right", the concept of feminism has been active for a while now... and yet, look where we are.

I'm honestly thinking about just having a daughter myself. The state of the world is too dire for a son. I think men just have too much invested in exploiting women, and women will have to make the next big move themselves.

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Wandering_Feminist56
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May 10 2025, 3:37 AM
#5
(May 9 2025, 11:48 AM)Irinka8347 I don't want to rely on people "teaching" their boys; everyone thinks, "Oh, I'm gonna raise my son right", the concept of feminism has been active for a while now... and yet, look where we are.
Yeah, there's little hope in this. The same society that's responsible for a whole lot of bad statistics, especially men of course, is also the society that raises the next generation. Class consciousness on the axis of womanhood is a dirty, forbidden thing, and nobody wants to think of their son as a potential future rapist and abuser, no matter the high likelihood of that happening. Parents would protest; ''why should my precious son be treated like a criminal just for being born male?!'' I see so little awareness about this in parents I know who have a son, it's just not a focus of theirs.

Millennials are also having kids by now, and they're the most pornsick generation there is, I think. They came of age in a social climate where it was downright embarrassing to have sexual boundaries or dislike porn, women discouraged themselves and each other of having dignity when it came to sex, they were supposed to be the cool girl who checked out attractive women along with their husbands. ''nice rack'', they were supposed to say, and not quietly die inside, but that's secondary. (dying inside is actually fine, but never become an uncool prude)

We have, imo, still a massive taboo on the inherent issues around porn and that's not helping with doing aything about rape and porn culture.
Edited May 10 2025, 3:38 AM by Wandering_Feminist56.
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Wandering_Feminist56
May 10 2025, 3:37 AM #5

(May 9 2025, 11:48 AM)Irinka8347 I don't want to rely on people "teaching" their boys; everyone thinks, "Oh, I'm gonna raise my son right", the concept of feminism has been active for a while now... and yet, look where we are.
Yeah, there's little hope in this. The same society that's responsible for a whole lot of bad statistics, especially men of course, is also the society that raises the next generation. Class consciousness on the axis of womanhood is a dirty, forbidden thing, and nobody wants to think of their son as a potential future rapist and abuser, no matter the high likelihood of that happening. Parents would protest; ''why should my precious son be treated like a criminal just for being born male?!'' I see so little awareness about this in parents I know who have a son, it's just not a focus of theirs.

Millennials are also having kids by now, and they're the most pornsick generation there is, I think. They came of age in a social climate where it was downright embarrassing to have sexual boundaries or dislike porn, women discouraged themselves and each other of having dignity when it came to sex, they were supposed to be the cool girl who checked out attractive women along with their husbands. ''nice rack'', they were supposed to say, and not quietly die inside, but that's secondary. (dying inside is actually fine, but never become an uncool prude)

We have, imo, still a massive taboo on the inherent issues around porn and that's not helping with doing aything about rape and porn culture.

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OffMyTit
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May 10 2025, 6:36 PM
#6
(May 9 2025, 11:48 AM)Irinka8347 That's why I think people should stop having so many boys lol. Whether one thinks their problems are genetic or environmental, I think this is not a good era to raise a male child (has it ever been? Idk)... But now it's more technologically feasible than ever to skip the genetic roulette. I don't want to rely on people "teaching" their boys; everyone thinks, "Oh, I'm gonna raise my son right", the concept of feminism has been active for a while now... and yet, look where we are.

I'm honestly thinking about just having a daughter myself. The state of the world is too dire for a son. I think men just have too much invested in exploiting women, and women will have to make the next big move themselves.

Totally agree! In fact, the misogyny of believing all the women before you just didn’t try hard enough not to raise misogynists and rapists, but you’ll succeed where they failed, is staggering.
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OffMyTit
May 10 2025, 6:36 PM #6

(May 9 2025, 11:48 AM)Irinka8347 That's why I think people should stop having so many boys lol. Whether one thinks their problems are genetic or environmental, I think this is not a good era to raise a male child (has it ever been? Idk)... But now it's more technologically feasible than ever to skip the genetic roulette. I don't want to rely on people "teaching" their boys; everyone thinks, "Oh, I'm gonna raise my son right", the concept of feminism has been active for a while now... and yet, look where we are.

I'm honestly thinking about just having a daughter myself. The state of the world is too dire for a son. I think men just have too much invested in exploiting women, and women will have to make the next big move themselves.

Totally agree! In fact, the misogyny of believing all the women before you just didn’t try hard enough not to raise misogynists and rapists, but you’ll succeed where they failed, is staggering.

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Irinka8347
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May 10 2025, 10:18 PM
#7
(May 10 2025, 6:36 PM)OffMyTit
(May 9 2025, 11:48 AM)Irinka8347 That's why I think people should stop having so many boys lol. Whether one thinks their problems are genetic or environmental, I think this is not a good era to raise a male child (has it ever been? Idk)... But now it's more technologically feasible than ever to skip the genetic roulette. I don't want to rely on people "teaching" their boys; everyone thinks, "Oh, I'm gonna raise my son right", the concept of feminism has been active for a while now... and yet, look where we are.
I'm honestly thinking about just having a daughter myself. The state of the world is too dire for a son. I think men just have too much invested in exploiting women, and women will have to make the next big move themselves.

Totally agree! In fact, the misogyny of believing all the women before you just didn’t try hard enough not to raise misogynists and rapists, but you’ll succeed where they failed, is staggering.

(I didn't get notifications to you and the other poster’s responses, sorry 😭.) Yeah, I was actually thinking about that too! I made a thread on the Female Separatism forum regarding sex-selective IVF and it touched upon this idea, like "RIP to my mother and her mother before her, but I'm different." I doubt many people actually think of it that way, but that's the very implication... I will grant that some of these women think it's because men haven't been involved fathers (so it's men's fault), but then that comes to the issue of "picking better"... 

Honestly, I just kind of think a lot of women have a knee-jerk response to the idea of taking real action against men. We're all groomed to prioritize them above ourselves; even if someone can recognize that a stove is hot when she touches it, she might feel sentimental value for it. (Or maybe they lack the imagination to envision a world that isn’t full of male crime. We kind of glorify it, actually, judging by human media… But, what if each society was, say, 70/30 F/M. What kind of cultures could we have? Imagine it, y’all!) I just want to lay it out plainly for them--having a son isn't a neutral choice in this world, unless you think women just haven't tried hard enough to act against the forces of this world. By having a son, you're directly increasing the chance that future women and girls will be hurt, and I’m sure you know this on some level... You’ve just decided it’s worth the risk for some reason. There will always be women who want to give birth to sons, I'm pretty sure (most women, I would think), so it's not like we're going to cause a population crash by getting the few women who care about their fellow women and girls on board... Men literally don't come out of thin air. Even boys hurt their female classmates; misogyny starts early. 

Or, to put it even more plainly, I bet the mothers of the men who subscribe to r/degradingholes didn't think their sons would turn out like that, either. Maybe they even think their sons are good men. Can you guarantee that you have what it takes to not create another subscriber to that subreddit? Would you willingly give birth to a child who could be motivated to turn around and degrade the organs he ripped open inside of you? And very importantly, can you guarantee it for the sake of women and girls in the future? Like, if your own safety doesn’t move you (or your conscience tells you that you must accept the possibility of gestating an XY), think of the next generation of girls, at least 😭. Your mistakes, if you make any, will be paid for by them… Like, if you believe in female solidarity at all, I don’t see why you would do this. 

If those women learn about places like the subreddit I just mentioned (or world history, to be honest), and still think they have some reason to have sons, then I don't even know... All XYs come from somewhere. Pretty sure if a critical mass of women agreed not to have sons, there simply would not be a patriarchy. There literally could not be. I would think this is a small ask to prevent things like war rapes and gang rapes and all, but I guess there’s some reason to actively pursue having a male child? Like, you bring home a bundle of joy anyway 😭. Why are you so invested in said bundle of joy potentially growing up to have higher upper body strength and a dick. Why. There seem to be plenty of reasons against it, and none for it…
Edited May 10 2025, 11:34 PM by Irinka8347.
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Irinka8347
May 10 2025, 10:18 PM #7

(May 10 2025, 6:36 PM)OffMyTit
(May 9 2025, 11:48 AM)Irinka8347 That's why I think people should stop having so many boys lol. Whether one thinks their problems are genetic or environmental, I think this is not a good era to raise a male child (has it ever been? Idk)... But now it's more technologically feasible than ever to skip the genetic roulette. I don't want to rely on people "teaching" their boys; everyone thinks, "Oh, I'm gonna raise my son right", the concept of feminism has been active for a while now... and yet, look where we are.
I'm honestly thinking about just having a daughter myself. The state of the world is too dire for a son. I think men just have too much invested in exploiting women, and women will have to make the next big move themselves.

Totally agree! In fact, the misogyny of believing all the women before you just didn’t try hard enough not to raise misogynists and rapists, but you’ll succeed where they failed, is staggering.

(I didn't get notifications to you and the other poster’s responses, sorry 😭.) Yeah, I was actually thinking about that too! I made a thread on the Female Separatism forum regarding sex-selective IVF and it touched upon this idea, like "RIP to my mother and her mother before her, but I'm different." I doubt many people actually think of it that way, but that's the very implication... I will grant that some of these women think it's because men haven't been involved fathers (so it's men's fault), but then that comes to the issue of "picking better"... 

Honestly, I just kind of think a lot of women have a knee-jerk response to the idea of taking real action against men. We're all groomed to prioritize them above ourselves; even if someone can recognize that a stove is hot when she touches it, she might feel sentimental value for it. (Or maybe they lack the imagination to envision a world that isn’t full of male crime. We kind of glorify it, actually, judging by human media… But, what if each society was, say, 70/30 F/M. What kind of cultures could we have? Imagine it, y’all!) I just want to lay it out plainly for them--having a son isn't a neutral choice in this world, unless you think women just haven't tried hard enough to act against the forces of this world. By having a son, you're directly increasing the chance that future women and girls will be hurt, and I’m sure you know this on some level... You’ve just decided it’s worth the risk for some reason. There will always be women who want to give birth to sons, I'm pretty sure (most women, I would think), so it's not like we're going to cause a population crash by getting the few women who care about their fellow women and girls on board... Men literally don't come out of thin air. Even boys hurt their female classmates; misogyny starts early. 

Or, to put it even more plainly, I bet the mothers of the men who subscribe to r/degradingholes didn't think their sons would turn out like that, either. Maybe they even think their sons are good men. Can you guarantee that you have what it takes to not create another subscriber to that subreddit? Would you willingly give birth to a child who could be motivated to turn around and degrade the organs he ripped open inside of you? And very importantly, can you guarantee it for the sake of women and girls in the future? Like, if your own safety doesn’t move you (or your conscience tells you that you must accept the possibility of gestating an XY), think of the next generation of girls, at least 😭. Your mistakes, if you make any, will be paid for by them… Like, if you believe in female solidarity at all, I don’t see why you would do this. 

If those women learn about places like the subreddit I just mentioned (or world history, to be honest), and still think they have some reason to have sons, then I don't even know... All XYs come from somewhere. Pretty sure if a critical mass of women agreed not to have sons, there simply would not be a patriarchy. There literally could not be. I would think this is a small ask to prevent things like war rapes and gang rapes and all, but I guess there’s some reason to actively pursue having a male child? Like, you bring home a bundle of joy anyway 😭. Why are you so invested in said bundle of joy potentially growing up to have higher upper body strength and a dick. Why. There seem to be plenty of reasons against it, and none for it…

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Irinka8347
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May 10 2025, 10:54 PM
#8
(May 10 2025, 3:37 AM)Wandering_Feminist56
(May 9 2025, 11:48 AM)Irinka8347 I don't want to rely on people "teaching" their boys; everyone thinks, "Oh, I'm gonna raise my son right", the concept of feminism has been active for a while now... and yet, look where we are.
Yeah, there's little hope in this. The same society that's responsible for a whole lot of bad statistics, especially men of course, is also the society that raises the next generation. Class consciousness on the axis of womanhood is a dirty, forbidden thing, and nobody wants to think of their son as a potential future rapist and abuser, no matter the high likelihood of that happening. Parents would protest; ''why should my precious son be treated like a criminal just for being born male?!'' I see so little awareness about this in parents I know who have a son, it's just not a focus of theirs.

Millennials are also having kids by now, and they're the most pornsick generation there is, I think. They came of age in a social climate where it was downright embarrassing to have sexual boundaries or dislike porn, women discouraged themselves and each other of having dignity when it came to sex, they were supposed to be the cool girl who checked out attractive women along with their husbands. ''nice rack'', they were supposed to say, and not quietly die inside, but that's secondary. (dying inside is actually fine, but never become an uncool prude)

We have, imo, still a massive taboo on the inherent issues around porn and that's not helping with doing aything about rape and porn culture.

That’s interesting, what you said about boy parents… I don’t know anyone who’s currently having children, so I appreciate this insight :D. 

You said they haven’t thought much about it, but I think it’s such a selfish thing to do, especially since they’re not just gambling on their pride, but the futures of their son’s female peers… I kind of want to ask those parents, “You see these headlines and think those parents all raised their boys wrong?” Or maybe flip it around on them: “Why should my precious daughter be treated like an object in a world full of men created by thoughtless parents? Are you going to say to girls like her, RIP, but my son is different? Like every parent of a misogynistic son?” (I don’t even know if I would address male parents; we’ve all seen the statistics on domestic labor and violence, lol. They can’t be trusted to do the right thing. I personally might consider being a single mother by choice, if not 4B... Seems to be on the rise in recent years.) 

I do have some hope that young women can be reached, though… I’ve seen a few complaints now from men that Gen Z feminists (young women and girls at this point) aren’t “inclusive” or sex-positive (🤢) enough. In fact, yours truly is one of them, lol.
Edited May 10 2025, 11:40 PM by Irinka8347.
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Irinka8347
May 10 2025, 10:54 PM #8

(May 10 2025, 3:37 AM)Wandering_Feminist56
(May 9 2025, 11:48 AM)Irinka8347 I don't want to rely on people "teaching" their boys; everyone thinks, "Oh, I'm gonna raise my son right", the concept of feminism has been active for a while now... and yet, look where we are.
Yeah, there's little hope in this. The same society that's responsible for a whole lot of bad statistics, especially men of course, is also the society that raises the next generation. Class consciousness on the axis of womanhood is a dirty, forbidden thing, and nobody wants to think of their son as a potential future rapist and abuser, no matter the high likelihood of that happening. Parents would protest; ''why should my precious son be treated like a criminal just for being born male?!'' I see so little awareness about this in parents I know who have a son, it's just not a focus of theirs.

Millennials are also having kids by now, and they're the most pornsick generation there is, I think. They came of age in a social climate where it was downright embarrassing to have sexual boundaries or dislike porn, women discouraged themselves and each other of having dignity when it came to sex, they were supposed to be the cool girl who checked out attractive women along with their husbands. ''nice rack'', they were supposed to say, and not quietly die inside, but that's secondary. (dying inside is actually fine, but never become an uncool prude)

We have, imo, still a massive taboo on the inherent issues around porn and that's not helping with doing aything about rape and porn culture.

That’s interesting, what you said about boy parents… I don’t know anyone who’s currently having children, so I appreciate this insight :D. 

You said they haven’t thought much about it, but I think it’s such a selfish thing to do, especially since they’re not just gambling on their pride, but the futures of their son’s female peers… I kind of want to ask those parents, “You see these headlines and think those parents all raised their boys wrong?” Or maybe flip it around on them: “Why should my precious daughter be treated like an object in a world full of men created by thoughtless parents? Are you going to say to girls like her, RIP, but my son is different? Like every parent of a misogynistic son?” (I don’t even know if I would address male parents; we’ve all seen the statistics on domestic labor and violence, lol. They can’t be trusted to do the right thing. I personally might consider being a single mother by choice, if not 4B... Seems to be on the rise in recent years.) 

I do have some hope that young women can be reached, though… I’ve seen a few complaints now from men that Gen Z feminists (young women and girls at this point) aren’t “inclusive” or sex-positive (🤢) enough. In fact, yours truly is one of them, lol.

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